Wilson!
This stems from another comment on a forum where somebody talked about how they stayed in a toxic relationship because they feared loneliness. Other people joined in by saying that they came out too broken to be anything other than lonely. Really made me think about how much a single relationship can damage a person. It can result in them never having a 100% healthy relationship again. It’s a known fear, which is why some people will stay in agony because they think loneliness is worse.
I definitely don’t fall on the ‘stay in agony’ camp, but I do feel loneliness a lot. Many of my friends have families or are too far away to get together so often. Made new friends since the divorce with several fizzling out due to me not being into the same stuff. At least, that’s what I thought, but it’s really just residual pain and me being afraid to open up to other people. This results in loneliness being what I get, which comes with its own type of suffering. Makes me wonder about the psychological fragility of humans, which is an entirely different topic.
Still, I can see the temptation to stay in a bad relationship because you’re afraid that the alternative is a lifetime of loneliness. Humans are social animals, so the threat of isolation is terrifying to most. We can bullshit ourselves by believing things will get better if we hang in there even if the other person is clearly not changing. We start to accept blame for everything in the hopes of appeasing the other person and getting our lifeline of human connection to improve or last. People can lose their sense of self-worth and identity because of this ‘versus’. The end is usually total psychological collapse and/or the relationship ends because they are no longer seen as useful. The loneliness strikes no matter what in both situations.
Cleary, this post is sad and dark with no real connection to writing. We can make characters in these situations to help others recognize their plights and find a way out, but that’s it. Maybe that’s enough though.
Legends of Windemere 
I’ve been in a toxic relationship which would have gotten worse had we married, so I’m glad to be out of it. Though I have felt lonely, the relief at not being in that relationship far outweighs the loneliness.
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It’s an odd balancing act from what I can tell. Relief you’re not being hurt, but wishing you had someone.
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I’m more of a loner than I thought I was. As life has changed, I find myself alone quite often. That doesn’t mean, I don’t enjoy the presence of others. The online author community has been good to fill some of the gaps.
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Huh. Second person to mention the online author community. That’s cool.
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Any loneliness I might feel from creeping old age is more than filled by the online author community and by writing. Characters fill my life. Luckily I’ve never had a toxic relationship but I have great sympathy for those who do.
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Good to hear online communities help.
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Yes that is so true, I wouldn’t be coping so well with widowhood in times past if I was stuck in a remote cottage with no electricity!
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I join you in the camp of not hanging in there when things get toxic. I have never been one to be lonely, but I have terminated relationships when it was clear mutual support was no longer part of the mix.
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It’s hard to recognize too. People tend to stay in toxic relationships longer than they should.
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So true.
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The other inside of loneliness is being widowed when you were happily married. The positives are feeling grounded and having a positive base of good memories. The downside, is no longer having your own team if your family are grown and have their own families. No one at home to laugh about the day’s events or television etc. Many people are on their own for various reasons and I’m sure that is better than being in any sort of toxic relationship with people you share a home with.
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That does sound really rough. Though the good memories are a solid positive. Toxic relationships lack that. I’ve found that any potential positive memories are tainted with missed red flags.
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You’re thinking out loud, well writing your thoughts down. That is a mind clearing and refocusing thing to do. It’s good!
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Thanks.
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You’re welcome.
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I think there’s a myth that people don’t recognize the toxic relationship when they’re in it, but I’m sure they do. Like you said, they think the alternative is worse. In fiction I read, it’s most often youth breaking away from toxic parents, but I’m sure in other genres there are toxic friendships and romances.
Your point about using stories to help people recognize there is a future is a good one. Sometimes that will reach people when conversation wouldn’t.
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From experience, I can say that you don’t really recognize toxicity. Love causes you to rationalize what the other person does. You think it’s just them in a temporary mood or blame outside influences instead of them. So, you stay in thinking you’re helping them when you’re just letting yourself get hurt more.
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I don’t know what to say about this. It’s a really good piece of writing. I hope it’s part of a process for you. The writer is well. At least he’s getting well. Getting better that is. Better is really well. It’s all we can hope for. “It’s getting so much better all the time.” That’s really it. – SSW
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Recovery from such things tends to be ups and downs. Maybe those who get out of toxic relationships can leave all the pain behind, but that sense loneliness is tough to process. As you said, it’s all part of the process.
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I’ve certainly dealt with with a lot of toxic people but it was worse when people were subtle about it (gaslighting, dog whistles, manipulation, etc) with me where I felt stupid for not picking up on the warning signs earlier. It was horrible when I stood up for myself and was treated like the bad guy. Sometimes I pondered if I should have been toxic to these toxic people on purpose to make them feel bad and to hold a mirror to their behavior while making sure they suffer like I had on a psychological level. Sadly, I never had the chance to make people feel ashamed of what they did to me.
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Making a victim feel wrong about standing up for themselves is a common narcissist tactic. It stems from their low self-esteem and sense of always being the victim. If you act toxic towards them, they don’t feel bad or acknowledge they’re getting a taste of their own medicine. It actually makes them ‘stronger’ because they can point at these actions to villainize you. This gets them sympathy and nurturing from their support system composed of people who aren’t close enough to the real victim to see what’s happening. Most of those people will ignore the behavior too because they’re composed of those who have fostered the issue for years without realizing it. Kind of like they’ve become a narcissistic hive mind. As far as the person themselves, I’ve learned that even showing them proof of their harmful actions gets you nowhere. They simply deny or say they were misunderstood.
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It’s something I wished when I was a lot younger in finding out the intricacies of how narcissitic people can be. I’ve wondered how I can best get back at those people who made my life hell. Part of me wanted to find ways to ruin their self esteem and have a big smile or use other people’s words against them. It’s like they are so immune and get away with everything. It’s no wonder why I have internalized a lot of stuff, got into certain hobbies to prove I’m competent and not stupid while also waiting for ways to make others who make fun of me look stupid with whatever talents I’ve been improving on. I hate how I’ve been manipulated and for those who downplay the hurt I’ve been through even when I tell the truth about it.
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Narcissistic people actually have incredibly low self-esteem. You can’t ruin what they don’t have. It’s replaced by a sense of victimhood that those around them will feed. Usually the feeding is done without those people realizing the issue because they’re not around the narcissist’s target. If a sympathy source begins to notice, the narcissist will turn on them and get them removed from the group. They might even have a group leader who will do it because they’re another narcissist who utilizes the same people. Those types can feed off each other if they’re in pairings.
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I see. Sometimes it could be hard to notice that. I have low self-esteem, but I don’t inflate my own ego and I’m upfront about it while also saying negative things about myself. Even complimenting myself is hard unless I feel like I’ve earned the right to do so like accomplishing something because others would always have me prove I was good at this or that. If I said anything nice about myself, I’m accused of being arrogant as if I wasn’t allowed to say anything positive about me. However, others could straight-up brag and never get questioned. So you’re insinuating that they shouldn’t be contacted if the narcissist(s) hurt someone so they don’t have anything to feed on? What about those with big egos?
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Egos are fed by confrontation. I’ve found that ignoring works best if possible. They crave attention to achieve self-worth. If their victim stops feeding them, they’ll either go away or start getting more desperate to agitate.
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I see. Ignoring can be tough when you see other people rip apart each other to show how good they are. Are you a psych major out of curiosity? It’s like there are selective situations on when to call people out without condemnation from others.
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I was a creative writing major. Took a bunch of psych classes and gone through a lot of therapy. Sadly, there are selective situations for this.
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Makes a lot of sense since you’re an author, but I didn’t want to assume. Therapy is something I respect if that helps others, but I had negative experiences with therapists when I was insulted by one at college my freshman year. I swear it’s like people don’t want me to stand up for myself or confront anyone when they bring up selective situations like I somehow can’t criticize anyone who does wrong when they should be criticized.
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Shame the therapist insulted you. Sorry about that.
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Thanks. I wasn’t trying to ask for sympathy, but it did affect how I view most therapists. It’s not the worst thing that ever happened to me in my life, but it frustrated me so much because it felt like I couldn’t talk to a lot of people lest my issues get mocked or downplayed.
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Interesting read!
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Thanks.
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